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a condtradiction in terms

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes Karen wrote despairingly of depression and pain and pain and depression — Me, too, Karen — I am so terribly depressed.  For at least the past month it has been getting worse and worse.  Paxil quit working (50 mg) and amitriptylene (150 mg) has not cut the depression.  My psychiatrist when I called him before Thanksgiving sounded hesitant and was reluctant to change anything because he would be out of town.  I interpreted that to mean he might increase Paxil, so I did it myself — up to 70 mg.  I, of course, told him I had done that (4 days later) and he said I was already on the max dose he had ever given.  He said he had never heard of anyone taking 70 mg.  Did I have any side effects? No.  So, he said my liver must really be metabolizing the stuff.  That is typical for me.  So, he said go ahead and give it a try.  But, I am so depressed.  To top it off, my copy of AOL was corrupted and I was in newsgroup withdrawal for three days.  Hi, my name is Marnette and I am an addict. My psychiatrist asked again to list all the antidepressants I had tried:  Ludiomil, Pamelor, Zoloft, Prozac, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Daypro — and I don’t remember any others. He said that I really might consider ECT (electroconvulsive therapy).  I got a cold chill.  I said that I just couldn’t consider that.  They no longer use the brutal approach of One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest. Muscle relaxants are given and you just get one brief zap.  He said that there are a lot of people who have had it that swear by it.  I am just so depressed.  Suicide is out of the question.  I just couldn’t do that to my family  (they are left with untold guilt and pain and anger).  Besides, I am a coward. I have thought about it a lot today.  Maybe my brain has gotten a short circuit in it and that a disruption in the electrical activity would allow it to reset itself.  Maybe pushing the reset button would of course mean a clear head with no pain and no depression. Sounds reasonable.  Sounds terrible.  Does anyone know anyone who has had it?  Have you had it? I made an appointment with a different psychologist (you have to try them on for size, they don’t always fit) for a second opinion.  I also called and got me set up with Chris Edward’s pain management guy (who he says is aggressive).  But what am I going to do while I wait out the two weeks.  My niece (very small family) is getting married Saturday and we are supposed to drive six hours Friday night.  I really WANT to be there and I really DON’T want to go.  I really don’t want to go.  My family will be very disappointed if I don’t show up.  I finally decided to postpone worrying about it by doing what I needed to be ready to go, but that I do not have to decide to go for sure until Friday afternoon.  I was too sick Monday to go to my psychologist.  He is so booked I’ll never get another appointment until my next one. Ramble, ramble on.  I can’t go to sleep even with 150mg amitrip and Ambien until midnight, 1, 2am. I don’t know what I expect anyone to say that I don’t already know.  Depression is so insidious that you don’t know you are in a deep hole until you are in it.  I was just doing great (except for migraines) until the Paxil quit being effective. That’s where I’m at — in a deep hole. Marnette x-no-archive: yes x-no-archive: yes

Oh Marnette, I am so very sorry things are that bad for you.  You are always very compassionate and supportive with everyone who needs you, but now it’s time to concentrate on yourself! From what I know of ECT (not much), it is quite helpful, and a real life saver for some people.  What they do is actually induce a Grand Mal Seizure, but the seizure is somewhat controlled with muscle-relaxers and valium or like drug.  I have never had ECT, but have had two seizures in my life.  The only effects that still bother me are the long and short term memory loss, and this will occur with having ECT. If you have the mental and emotional strength, try to do research on the internet.  There is only one address I can think of right now: http://www.mentalhealth.com.  If you do a search using keywords like Psychiatric Disorders, Mental Disorders or even Electroconvulsive Therapy, maybe you could get some concrete information to help with your dilema(sp? my head hurts too bad to spell correctly). When you’re in constant pain, and depression it’s very difficult to make an intellegent, informed decission about what to do.  IMO, if you have a good, long-term relationship with the doctor who recommended the ECT, and you get good information on the procedure, trust your instincts, and do what you have to do to get yourself better.  My heart goes out to you, Marnette, and I wish you the greatest success with whatever decission you make.   You have tried to help so many people on this newsgroup, including myself, and now it’s time for you.  Please let everyone know what you need.  It is YOUR turn! My best, Mary

Response:

Mary, Marnette and eveybody else cause  even if you aren’t telling I know you are depressed cause no one could live like this and not be, I didn’t get the original article (stupid dejanews…gotta get a new provider so I can havve my newsgroups back and get all the articles again) but I know we all suffer with the pain and depression. I kind of look at it like the chicken and the egg: which comes first the depression or the migraine and does it relly matter cause they are all there. I know there are all those chemical thingies going on in the body  that trigger the migraines and the depression (i.e the seratonin) but I think it’s not so unusual for people to be in pain to be depressed Gosh I don’t know anyone that wouldn’t be. And then it is almost like a vicious cucle… The migraines make for pain the pain makes for depression the depression  makes you not sleep good then you a get another migraine and the migraine causes pain …. on and on it goes… Plus look at the meds that we take that’s depressing in and of itself the whole situationis depressing and then it is depressing that we can’t handle our lives the way we used too  or the way we would like But I tell you what if the BatBrat can handle it I know you can too BatBrat is a big whimp especially when I am hiding in my bat cave (my bedroom, all nice and dark and quiet, but isolation is depressing too) Dang this letter is depressing but at least you know you are not alone and that goes for all the lurkers out there not posting and just reading You are not alone either   Anyone who doesn’t get depressed can email me and tell me how they do it And if this makes you more depressed I’m sorry you can borry Dorothie’s axe or Ellen’s flail and knock me out but good (then I would be unconscious and wouldn’t feel the pain so I might not get depressed) Try to smile Karen

Response:

x-no-archive: yes

Karen and Marnette, I’ve been in that hole–extreme pain and being unconcious sounds heavenly–except for the permanent damage it could do to your body.  I’m not talking suicide either, but sometimes 4 o5 Fiorinal with Codeine might seem helpful.   Well, don’t listen to me and don’t do it!  There are other antidepressants and drugs for migraine.  Also, a headache/pain clinic might be warranted when all these meds fail to give relief. Marnette, have you checked out the newsgroup on depression–might be some helpful insights over there. I have MS in addition to the migraines, so depression is a condition caused by the physiological processes of each-double whammy.  It is SOOOO frustrating.   Doctor switched me from Paxil because it didn’t prevent migraine and I went cold turkey, immediately on Effexor and I thought I was going to go crazy with not only the physical but also the mental pain.  The doctor is now changing back to Paxil, but half the dose I was on (go figure) and Periactin for the migraines. Well, I feel like I have to try whatever. I don’t know about ECT except that it will wipe out some of your memory.  Talk to a psychiatrist you trust first. Hugs and love to you both, Lois in Michigan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Karen wrote despairingly of depression and pain and pain and depression — Me, too, Karen — I am so terribly depressed.  For at least the past month it has been getting worse and worse.  Paxil quit working (50 mg) and amitriptylene (150 mg) has not cut the depression.  My psychiatrist when I called him before Thanksgiving sounded hesitant and was reluctant to change anything because he would be out of town.  I interpreted that to mean he might increase Paxil, so I did it myself — up to 70 mg.  I, of course, told him I had done that (4 days later) and he said I was already on the max dose he had ever given.  He said he had never heard of anyone taking 70 mg.  Did I have any side effects? No.  So, he said my liver must really be metabolizing the stuff.  That is typical for me.  So, he said go ahead and give it a try.  But, I am so depressed.  To top it off, my copy of AOL was corrupted and I was in newsgroup withdrawal for three days.  Hi, my name is Marnette and I am an addict.   My psychiatrist asked again to list all the antidepressants I had tried:  Ludiomil, Pamelor, Zoloft, Prozac, Effexor, Serzone, Wellbutrin, Daypro — and I don’t remember any others.   He said that I really might consider ECT (electroconvulsive therapy).  I got a cold chill.  I said that I just couldn’t consider that.  They no longer use the brutal approach of One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest. Muscle relaxants are given and you just get one brief zap.  He said that there are a lot of people who have had it that swear by it.  I am just so depressed.  Suicide is out of the question.  I just couldn’t do that to my family  (they are left with untold guilt and pain and anger).  Besides, I am a coward.   I have thought about it a lot today.  Maybe my brain has gotten a short circuit in it and that a disruption in the electrical activity would allow it to reset itself.  Maybe pushing the reset button would of course mean a clear head with no pain and no depression. Sounds reasonable.  Sounds terrible.  Does anyone know anyone who has had it?  Have you had it? I made an appointment with a different psychologist (you have to try them on for size, they don’t always fit) for a second opinion.  I also called and got me set up with Chris Edward’s pain management guy (who he says is aggressive).  But what am I going to do while I wait out the two weeks.  My niece (very small family) is getting married Saturday and we are supposed to drive six hours Friday night.  I really WANT to be there and I really DON’T want to go.  I really don’t want to go.  My family will be very disappointed if I don’t show up.  I finally decided to postpone worrying about it by doing what I needed to be ready to go, but that I do not have to decide to go for sure until Friday afternoon.  I was too sick Monday to go to my psychologist.  He is so booked I’ll never get another appointment until my next one.   Ramble, ramble on.  I can’t go to sleep even with 150mg amitrip and Ambien until midnight, 1, 2am. I don’t know what I expect anyone to say that I don’t already know.  Depression is so insidious that you don’t know you are in a deep hole until you are in it.  I was just doing great (except for migraines) until the Paxil quit being effective.  

Response:

I no longer get cluster headaches.  Why not?  Why did I get them to begin with?  Was I too good or too bad? Was it a randon act or one of specificity? Was it my fault, or the fault of somebody else?  Will they stay away or come back? Am I depressed or happy? Do I miss the pain or does it miss me? Was it a sign of strength or weakness?  Is it worse to know the headaches might return or to experience them everyday.  Why were they so cyclical? Any ideas, questions, concerns, answers…

Barry, I am so glad that your headaches are gone. I hope that they stay gone forever. I don’t know the answer to why you do or don’t and can’t tell you whether you will again. As you probably know many cluster sufferers have long periods between cycles. To address the fault issue, I think that lots of us blame ourselves or others for our headaches. Don’t. It is no one’s fault. Just chance and heredity. Do you miss the pain? Well, that isn’t as crazy as it sounds. You probably don’t miss it but you are so used to having it you don’t know how to feel without it. Are you depressed because you are a ha sufferer or happy that you are off cycle? I would be. Is the pain a sign of strength or weakness? I would say that the majority of us are very strong. We have to be, in order to deal with what we go through and the threat of still more headaches. I would say that it is hard to know that you might get them back but the best thing to do is enjoy your painfree hours and try to stay away from your triggers. Clusters are cyclical by nature. I hope that your painfree period is forever. — EllenP Headache Free Is My Fantasy

Response:

Karen and Marnette and Mary all got together and… I have thought about it a lot today.  Maybe my brain has gotten a short circuit in it and that a disruption in the electrical activity would allow it to reset itself.  Maybe pushing the reset button would of course mean a clear head with no pain and no depression. Sounds reasonable.  Sounds terrible.  Does anyone know anyone who has had it?  Have you had it?

That’s one way of looking at it, but is the psychologist hoping to stop the pain altogether or just help you cope with it?   (Sez he who could REALLY do with the latter.  Family wedding over the   weekend, and dammit do I hurt.  Oh, and there’s the new physio who   thinks the best way of dealing with someone who’s not responding too   quickly is to speak louder and repeat herself lots.  Does anyone object   to me just banging my head against the wall a few times?) If the first, they should be telling you about success rates.  If the second, well, it does sound like clutching at straws.  If there’s even the slightest hint that they think the pain is caused by psychological factors (like way too many do), they’ve not been paying attention when you’ve been telling them what drugs you’ve been on and what the effects have been. My niece (very small family) is getting married Saturday and we are supposed to drive six hours Friday night.  I really WANT to be there and I really DON’T want to go.  I really don’t want to go.  My family will be very disappointed if I don’t show up.

waaaay to familiar.  Mine was my father’s.  I could have done what my mother did, and just found something else to do for the evening, but all I could come up with was sitting in front of a computer playing with HTML and reading a.s.h.m and not having my pain jump up three notches for probably an entire week and <slaps forehead D’OH!!! Oh Marnette, I am so very sorry things are that bad for you.  You are always very compassionate and supportive with everyone who needs you, but now it’s time to concentrate on yourself!

Mary says good things. Oh, and because Debbie asked: the weather here is wonderful right now. Sunny, low to mid 20s (C), and apparently we now have a government so we’re allowed to stop worrying and enjoy it ;) Except all I’ve been doing is wandering up to the labs to read news to keep myself occupied and then crawling home to bed.  At least I’ve got the TENS.  It’s not been this bad for about 14 months.  Hate it. And I’m supposed to go to a party tomorrow night.  As if. suddenly grumpy, butting — Bryce Utting                          http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/~butting                 the cross before me, the world behind me                              no turning back

Response:

Karen and Marnette and Mary all got together and… I have thought about it a lot today.  Maybe my brain has gotten a short circuit in it and that a disruption in the electrical activity would allow it to reset itself.  Maybe pushing the reset button would of course mean a clear head with no pain and no depression. Sounds reasonable.  Sounds terrible.  Does anyone know anyone who has had it?  Have you had it?

That’s one way of looking at it, but is the psych hoping to stop the pain altogether or just help you cope with it?   (Sez he who could REALLY do with the latter.  Family wedding over the   weekend, and dammit do I hurt.  Oh, and there’s the new physio who   thinks the best way of dealing with someone who’s not responding too   quick is to speak louder and repeat herself lots.  Does anyone object   to me just banging my head against the wall a few times?) If the first, he should be telling you about success rates.  If the second, well, it does sound like clutching at straws.  If there’s even the slightest hint that he thinks the pain is caused by psychological factors (is it just me or do they all go for this cop-out?), he’s not been paying attention when you’ve been telling him what drugs you’ve been on and what the effects have been. My niece (very small family) is getting married Saturday and we are supposed to drive six hours Friday night.  I really WANT to be there and I really DON’T want to go.  I really don’t want to go.  My family will be very disappointed if I don’t show up.

waaaay to familiar.  Mine was my father’s.  I could have done what my mother did, and just found something else to do for the evening, but all I could come up with was sitting in front of a computer playing with HTML and reading a.s.h.m and not having my pain jump up three notches for probably an entire week and <slaps forehead D’OH!!! Oh Marnette, I am so very sorry things are that bad for you.  You are always very compassionate and supportive with everyone who needs you, but now it’s time to concentrate on yourself!

Mary says good things. Oh, and because Marnette asked and the article’s probably disappeared of the feed (which I’m not going to complain about because we have the author of the Bastard Operator From Hell running our news machine and he just sped up outgoing posts by several orders of magnitude.  Simon, I owe you a beer): the weather here is wonderful right now.  Sunny, low to mid 20s (C), and apparently we now have a government so we’re allowed to stop worrying and enjoy it ;) Except all I’ve been doing is wandering up to the labs to read news to keep myself occupied and then crawling home to bed.  At least I’ve got the TENS.  It’s not been this bad for about 14 months.  Hate it. And I’m supposed to go to a party tomorrow night.  As if. suddenly grumpy, butting — Bryce Utting                          http://www.cs.waikato.ac.nz/~butting                 the cross before me, the world behind me                              no turning back – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes Karen wrote despairingly of depression and pain and pain and depression — Me, too, Karen — I am so terribly depressed.  For at least the past month it has been getting worse and worse.  Paxil quit working (50 mg) and amitriptylene (150 mg) has not cut the depression.  My psychiatrist when I called him before Thanksgiving sounded hesitant and was reluctant to change anything because he would be out of town.  I interpreted that to mean he might increase Paxil, so I did it myself — up to 70 mg.  I, of course, told him I had done that (4 days later) and he said I was already on the max dose he had ever given.  He said he had never heard of anyone taking 70 mg.  Did I have any side effects? No.  So, he said my liver must really be metabolizing the stuff.  That is typical for me.  So, he said go ahead and give it a try.  But, I am so depressed.  To top it off, my copy of AOL was corrupted and I was in newsgroup withdrawal for three days.  Hi, my name is Marnette and I am an addict. My psychiatrist asked again to list all the antidepressants I had tried:  Ludiomil, Pamelor, Zoloft, Prozac, Effexor,

Response:

Mary wrote so nicely (cause she really is a nice person) and karen replied : Hi Bob, Excellent reply.

I thought so too! Common sense and facing the reality of this affliction is the only way to cope.

Cope? Is that what we are supposed to do????? Why didn’t someone tell me this??? Okay how the heck ya supposed to cope then when you’re head is being blown off from either the migraine or the CDH or the cure???? I believe we are all extremely strong,

You tarzan, me BatBrat weakling! determined individuals.

determined to scream if this all doesn’t stop!  Course screaming will make the headache worse but I won’t tell if you don’t tell!  Who else could endure this curse, and not resort to asking for "the black pill."  

The black pill? You mean there is something out there that I can’t find?  Now why doesn’t it surprise me that I haven’t heard of this one?????? Sometimes I think God chose us for a reason, in that, we are the only type of people who can actually suffer with this kind of pain and disruption in our lives, and still remain competent, intellegent, caring and all around nice people!

I am not enduring I don’t want to endure competent????  The BatBrat???? nahhhhhhhhhhh   she’s ready to go get herself committed ! intellegent?  well that last line should take care of the intelligent part! caring…okay I’ll give you that one it tears me up that everybody is treated the way we are just cause some stupid dotor can’t see our headaches even though they are etched out in pain across our faces every stupid day ! nice???? I’m tired of being nice! I’m tired of being tired! I’m tired of being sick ! I’m tired of being sick and tired!!! Your nice, I’m nice, we’re all nice.  Major pat on the back for all of us.  If anyone disagrees, I have a 2×4 attitude adjuster that I would like to break in before I pay some doctors a visit!  

Just make sure you knock me out! Now that would be nice!!!! Bet it would work better than the stupid meds they give me and the headache wouldn’t be so bad either especially since you gonna give me lidocaine first! Now seriously I am not picking on Mary.  I like Mary.   and Mary is really all of those things she described.   But as for me I am truly sick and tired of being sick and tired. and as caring as I may come across online you don’t want to run into me in the middle of a migraine ! I will either sob cause it hurts to much or bite your head off for the same reason. Mary please don’t take this article personally. It’s just not a good morning at all. Last night wasn’t good either. Tahnks for letting me vent and honest I am not picking on you just feeling sorry for myself. Yes I am depressed! Who wouldn’t be??? No I am not going to go kill myself although there are many times it would be wonderful not to have to wake up to have to have another headache. I keep hoping one day I will wake up and they will magically be gone POOF! Karen (a little crazy today cause it’s not a good day and I have a headache and I belong to an HMO and I am tired and……)

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mary wrote so nicely (cause she really is a nice person) and karen replied : Hi Bob, Excellent reply. I thought so too! Common sense and facing the reality of this affliction is the only way to cope. Cope? Is that what we are supposed to do????? Why didn’t someone tell me this??? Okay how the heck ya supposed to cope then when you’re head is being blown off from either the migraine or the CDH or the cure???? I believe we are all extremely strong, You tarzan, me BatBrat weakling! determined individuals. determined to scream if this all doesn’t stop!  Course screaming will make the headache worse but I won’t tell if you don’t tell!  Who else could endure this curse, and not resort to asking for "the black pill." The black pill? You mean there is something out there that I can’t find?  Now why doesn’t it surprise me that I haven’t heard of this one?????? Sometimes I think God chose us for a reason, in that, we are the only type of people who can actually suffer with this kind of pain and disruption in our lives, and still remain competent, intellegent, caring and all around nice people! I am not enduring I don’t want to endure competent????  The BatBrat???? nahhhhhhhhhhh   she’s ready to go get herself committed ! intellegent?  well that last line should take care of the intelligent part! caring…okay I’ll give you that one it tears me up that everybody is treated the way we are just cause some stupid dotor can’t see our headaches even though they are etched out in pain across our faces every stupid day ! nice???? I’m tired of being nice! I’m tired of being tired! I’m tired of being sick ! I’m tired of being sick and tired!!! Your nice, I’m nice, we’re all nice.  Major pat on the back for all of us.  If anyone disagrees, I have a 2×4 attitude adjuster that I would like to break in before I pay some doctors a visit! Just make sure you knock me out! Now that would be nice!!!! Bet it would work better than the stupid meds they give me and the headache wouldn’t be so bad either especially since you gonna give me lidocaine first! Now seriously I am not picking on Mary.  I like Mary. and Mary is really all of those things she described. But as for me I am truly sick and tired of being sick and tired. and as caring as I may come across online you don’t want to run into me in the middle of a migraine ! I will either sob cause it hurts to much or bite your head off for the same reason. Mary please don’t take this article personally. It’s just not a good morning at all. Last night wasn’t good either. Tahnks for letting me vent and honest I am not picking on you just feeling sorry for myself. Yes I am depressed! Who wouldn’t be??? No I am not going to go kill myself although there are many times it would be wonderful not to have to wake up to have to have another headache. I keep hoping one day I will wake up and they will magically be gone POOF! Karen (a little crazy today cause it’s not a good day and I have a headache and I belong to an HMO and I am tired and……)

Karen, Never underestimate how strong and competent you are.  As far as coping and enduring, everytime you make it through another day is proof of how strong you are.  At least, that’s how I think of myself.  Look at what you face day after day, and I’ll bet your a great mother.  Tell me this doesn’t take strength.  I’m not saying we have to be nice all of the time.  Sainthood is not one of my goals.  We all have the right to get frustrated, tired and irritable whenever we feel like it. In no way did I take your reply personally, but I have to repeat:  You are strong, competent and determined.  We all are.  Never underestimate yourself.  I’m not saying we should embrace or excell in suffering.   Just know that you ARE a strong person, and nice too!  Don’t make me come out there and adjust your attitude.  Everyone deserves a pat on the back, and occationally, a great big hug! Hang in there, Batgirl Mary

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Kranz) writes: I no longer get cluster headaches.  Why not? Barry, If we knew that, we’d be rich,rich,rich. We could sell the answer to the insurance companies for billions, and make a condition of sale that treatment would have to be free to patients. They’d still save billions in the future with no one to treat.  Why did I get them to begin with? See answer #1   Was I too good or too bad? I’m convinced that we’re too good <G  Was it a randon act or one of specificity? Was it my fault, or the fault of somebody else? I tend to believe that they are "environmentally based". Therefore I can blame somebody without being specific. If I could be specific, I may purchase and load a gun!!!  Will they stay away or come back? This one is easy. The answer is a definate YES. ( sorry, I like to be positive whenever possible )  Am I depressed or happy? They’re gone / You’re HAPPY  Do I miss the pain or does it miss me? Your pain ceased to exist, therefore it can’t miss anything. Was it a sign of strength or weakness? This is a definate sign of strength. To overcome a cycle of clusters is tantamount to climbing Mt. Everest, naked.  Is it worse to know the headaches might return or to experience them everyday. It is better to know that they may NEVER return.   Why were they so cyclical? You didn’t ask these tough questions when you were *in* your cluster. If they were chronic and constant, you and I wouldn’t be participating in this group, we’d be in a padded room with a Stadol IV in our arms. To be honest with you, this is the biggest question I always had. Even more than why I get them, it’s always been why do they come and go. What makes my body stop the pain. They come and go so quickly. My theory has been that *something* builds up in my body and when it gets to a certain level, the headache starts, when it has burned off the *fuel*, it stops, just like a car running out of gas. Oh well. what do I know!!! I know that I am really happy for you that your cycle broke and your cluster free!!!!! Bob

Hi Bob, Excellent reply.  Common sense and facing the reality of this affliction is the only way to cope.  I believe we are all extremely strong, determined individuals.  Who else could endure this curse, and not resort to asking for "the black pill."  Sometimes I think God chose us for a reason, in that, we are the only type of people who can actually suffer with this kind of pain and disruption in our lives, and still remain competent, intellegent, caring and all around nice people! Your nice, I’m nice, we’re all nice.  Major pat on the back for all of us.  If anyone disagrees, I have a 2×4 attitude adjuster that I would like to break in before I pay some doctors a visit!  To prove I’m a nice person, I will administer a shot of Lidocaine before wood makes contact with skull. Mary

Response:

Kranz) writes: I no longer get cluster headaches.  Why not?

Barry, If we knew that, we’d be rich,rich,rich. We could sell the answer to the insurance companies for billions, and make a condition of sale that treatment would have to be free to patients. They’d still save billions in the future with no one to treat.  Why did I get them to begin with?

See answer #1   Was I too good or too bad? I’m convinced that we’re too good <G  Was it a randon act or one of specificity? Was it my fault, or the fault of somebody else?

I tend to believe that they are "environmentally based". Therefore I can blame somebody without being specific. If I could be specific, I may purchase and load a gun!!!  Will they stay away or come back?

This one is easy. The answer is a definate YES. ( sorry, I like to be positive whenever possible )  Am I depressed or happy? They’re gone / You’re HAPPY  Do I miss the pain or does it miss me? Your pain ceased to exist, therefore it can’t miss anything. Was it a sign of strength or weakness?

This is a definate sign of strength. To overcome a cycle of clusters is tantamount to climbing Mt. Everest, naked.  Is it worse to know the headaches might return or to experience them everyday.

It is better to know that they may NEVER return.   Why were they so cyclical? You didn’t ask these tough questions when you were *in* your cluster. If they were chronic and constant, you and I wouldn’t be participating in this group, we’d be in a padded room with a Stadol IV in our arms. To be honest with you, this is the biggest question I always had. Even more than why I get them, it’s always been why do they come and go. What makes my body stop the pain. They come and go so quickly. My theory has been that *something* builds up in my body and when it gets to a certain level, the headache starts, when it has burned off the *fuel*, it stops, just like a car running out of gas. Oh well. what do I know!!! I know that I am really happy for you that your cycle broke and your cluster free!!!!! Bob

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – x-no-archive: yes Karen wrote despairingly of depression and pain and pain and depression — Me, too, Karen — I am so terribly depressed.  For at least the past month it has been getting worse and worse. That’s where I’m at — in a deep hole. Marnette x-no-archive: yes x-no-archive: yes

Marnette, I am sooo sorry that you are so depressed. I wish that I had something concrete to help you but I can only tell you that I will pray for you and if you research the zapper and it seems okay, I would give it a try. If you are like me you would try anything including a witch doctor. You can borrow my flail if you want or maybe Marty and Karen’s and bonk anyone who gives you a hard time about your pain. It is the scaring them doesn’t work, try a boink or two with the business end. It has sharp spikes and it is a very bright red. All kidding aside, I know where you are coming from and wish you no pain. Keep on keepin on. — EllenP Headache Free Is My Fantasy

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